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Are the US Navy Carrier Fleets Obsolete?

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RayearthIX #61 Posted 02 May 2017 - 03:13 PM

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I don't have much to add to the know how or reasons of why a Carriers won't be obsolete any time soon. As others have stated, destroying one would be difficult at best, and impossible for many nations entirely. Are they invincible? No, absolutely not. Will tech be created that counters them? Sure, someday.

 

However, to everyone commenting that armies are built based on the last war, that ignores the fact that the only nation on Earth that has been in a perpetual state of war for nearly its entire existence is the US (whether we call War or not). Since WWII, the US has been involved in one armed conflict or another almost in perpetuity, and the military has been evolving to meet those needs. The fact is that the world views us as a global peacekeeping force for them (barring the dozen or so nations who either want chaos, or want the power the US has). Yes, they complain (looking at you France), but when a problem arises, they usually ask the US for military aid (again looking at you France). That means the military and its components (such as Carriers) have continued to advance and evolve both offensively and defensively to be better protect against incoming attacks, and better destroy what is making those attacks. Again, that doesn't make it invincible, but it does mean that we are less likely to fall into the 'last war' trap. 

 

Personally, the only thing I think could make a carrier partially obsolete would be something like the Tuatha de Dannan from Full Metal Panic. A submersible aircraft carrier capable of reaching targets and launching planes with speed to submerge and escape would be invaluable because it would be nearly impossible to track. That or a space laser a la Hammer of Dawn from Gears of War, but last I checked that doesn't exist except in Bond movies and other sci-fi works. 

 

 

 



Carrier_Lexington #62 Posted 02 May 2017 - 11:19 PM

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View PostRayearthIX, on 02 May 2017 - 10:13 AM, said:

Personally, the only thing I think could make a carrier partially obsolete would be something like the Tuatha de Dannan from Full Metal Panic. A submersible aircraft carrier capable of reaching targets and launching planes with speed to submerge and escape would be invaluable because it would be nearly impossible to track. That or a space laser a la Hammer of Dawn from Gears of War, but last I checked that doesn't exist except in Bond movies and other sci-fi works. 

Personally, I think it's either that or a land-based high-powered laser that bounces the beam off of reflective satellites to hit any target on Earth, Reflex-Gun style. Of course, with treaties preventing orbital bombardment weapons (although, curiously enough, not orbital anti-missile weapons), and the amount of raw power that such a beam would need to function (the most powerful laser in the world is located at the NIF, and it is actually 192 lasers set-up in a RIDICULOUSLY huge facility, which operate for a relatively short period of time) and sustain the beam for more than a few seconds, these are decades away.

 

The Submersible super-carrier is probably more likely.


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Sethanas #63 Posted 03 May 2017 - 10:05 AM

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View PostCarrier_Lexington, on 02 May 2017 - 06:19 PM, said:

 with treaties preventing orbital bombardment weapons

 

Ahh but that's the beauty of kinetic bombardment.... who's to say that those solid tungsten rods were meant as weapons to start with... :hiding:

Fog_Cruiser_Wichita #64 Posted 03 May 2017 - 12:28 PM

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I can't believe all of you are assuming miracle weapons such as hypersonic anti-ship ballistic weapons will actually make it to a carrier.

 

I can't believe any of you are failing to take into account the massive amount of crap one would have to go through to get a solid firing solution on a single carrier in a carrier strike group.

 

I suggest you all put down your tinfoil hats and crazy theories, and go look objectively at what tech we have today, right now, fully deployed, and compare that to the rest of the world.

 

And I mean everything. EVERYTHING. Not just the carrier. EVERYTHING.


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Flashtirade #65 Posted 03 May 2017 - 09:30 PM

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B-but 1v1 scenarios are how the world works, right?

MrSparkle #66 Posted 09 May 2017 - 03:18 AM

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Is this thread talking about carriers as a sea power or a mobile air force? Because they're both, and no they're not obsolete at all.


They're expensive? Is that the main argument against them? Yeah they're expensive. Barring nukes a carrier group is one of the single most destructive forces in the world, with great range. The only thing more destructive is the US Air Force.

 

Missiles are NOT a counter to a carrier group. They may be the only possible way to stop them but they're not a counter. Nobody will be successfully attacking a carrier group with another surface group in my lifetime. Missiles will have to be used, and yeah there will be losses but it's not like missiles are some foolproof system.



MrSparkle #67 Posted 09 May 2017 - 03:22 AM

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And while carrier groups and the US Air Force are the single most destructive conventional forces in the world, it's intelligence that's their true strength. Knowing where the enemy is at all times, having detailed intel on movements, positioning etc. is the key. It's been the key since WW2. Everyone loves to talk about the grand battles of Europe and the Pacific but not many talk about the code-breakers and intel gathering that led to the Allied victory.


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Carrier_Lexington #68 Posted 09 May 2017 - 08:37 PM

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View PostMrSparkle, on 08 May 2017 - 10:22 PM, said:

And while carrier groups and the US Air Force are the single most destructive conventional forces in the world, it's intelligence that's their true strength. Knowing where the enemy is at all times, having detailed intel on movements, positioning etc. is the key. It's been the key since WW2. Everyone loves to talk about the grand battles of Europe and the Pacific but not many talk about the code-breakers and intel gathering that led to the Allied victory.


Nothing is more important. Nothing.

 

With reliable intelligence, one can use even horrendously out-dated technology to secure victory.

Also... that last sentence...

 


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MrSparkle #69 Posted 10 May 2017 - 12:27 AM

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View PostCarrier_Lexington, on 09 May 2017 - 08:37 PM, said:

 

With reliable intelligence, one can use even horrendously out-dated technology to secure victory.

Also... that last sentence...

 

 

Yeah, and now pair that superior intelligence with superior firepower and you have an indispensible force. Screw cost, the two combined are more valuable.

Shokaku_1 #70 Posted 12 May 2017 - 12:07 AM

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View PostPalladia, on 26 April 2017 - 12:41 AM, said:

 

Lemme quote this for emphasis.  Also the USS Independence survived a nuclear blast.  It melted her hull and would have killed everyone on board had there been anyone,  but she still weathered a nuke and kept floating.  The Independence.  Built in 1942.  I dare say we've made some advances in technology since then.

 

Not a good example, USS Princeton(CVL-23), also an Independent Class, was sunk by a single IJN 250kg bomb from a single IJN dive bomber, which was the only carrier sunk by a single bomb during WWII. If the Independence was like the Princeton in war condition loaded with fuels and ammunition, it wouldn't have survived the nuke.





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