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Game no longer fun; putting my wallet away


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kerensky914 #41 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:35 PM

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View PostTenguBlade, on 24 April 2017 - 02:29 PM, said:

Have you considered at all why that might be the case?  Perhaps you're dodging too predictably?

 

This.  Can't tell how many times lately I've watched a cruiser in my sights making a full-speed turn, and I wait and fire a salvo as his nose crosses my viewpoint.  Most of the time the full salvo catches him as the turn brings his full broadside open to me, with predictable results.  No hack needed, just timing.

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DasBootcamp #42 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:36 PM

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RevBC #43 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:36 PM

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Another one of these threads. Sigh... they come back. They always come back.

Fox_Cruiser_Marseillaise #44 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:37 PM

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Kick-[edited]premiums?  OK...MAYBE the Scharnhorst. The others are mostly gimmicky or have glaring weaknesses for the money spent. I have MANY, MANY premiums. Some I like, some I don't. But to say I'll be missing out on kick-a$$ premiums is overstating it by a large margin. Most premiums are Wargaming wallet-raids.

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kerensky914 #45 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:37 PM

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View PostFox_Cruiser_Algerie, on 24 April 2017 - 02:30 PM, said:

 

Nope. Witness the Solomons, where 6"-gunned cruisers pumped out thousands of shells and achieved......a couple hits in most scenarios. All I'm saying is sigma should be range-dependant, and it should be applied with an even hand across all the lines. No exceptions.

 

Well that is certainly better, at least you want it even.  Unfortunately, WG wants a game that is fun and fast-paced.  Hours long matches where you might not hit anything after a couple hundred shots sounds like a great formula for a game that no one plays.

 

And by no one, yes there'd be some die-hards who'll still play until WG pulls the plug.  Maybe even find a way to run a wildcat server.  But most players would be long gone.


Edited by kerensky914, 24 April 2017 - 08:39 PM.

"it is a tale, told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." - MacBeth, who was obviously talking about the forums...

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1nv4d3rZ1m #46 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:37 PM

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View PostFox_Cruiser_Algerie, on 24 April 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

Tengu:

 

Right you are, I tend to rely on the the Tier 1 skills and common sense to start my dodge. But it doesn't matter to be quite honest. The accuracy is so high that I will get hit no matter what. WASD hacks are useless when battleships can squash a cockroach at 19km. I even waffled between concealment mod and rudder shift. Even a six-second rudder shift and pre-manuvering results in deletion. I think alot of this is people using aim-mods which show direction the ship WILL manuver, and they can pre-aim. Again, its just not fun. Even a 17.6km range isn't enough to start shooting when I know the battleship can turn his guns are massacre me then go about his business.

 

Sigma has to be a function of range. I base my assessment and gripes on historical, World War II scenarios. Witness Iowa versus Katori. She could barely hit that tiny, slow ship even at modest range. Duke of York fired HUNDREDS of shots at Scharnhorst and couldn't affect her ability to fight or flee, except for one VERY LUCKY long-range shot. BB sigma should START at 1.0 minimum past 10km, scaling upward as range closes.

 

I don't understand why I should be punished for being a cruiser main, or even enjoying a certain line, regardless of performance characteristics.

 

 

Wait there is a mod that tells people how ships will maneuver? How does that even work? Is a mod now able to predict the actions of people? 

I consider myself pretty good at this game and a lot of its based on predicting peoples behavior and yet people constantly surprise me by making moves I thought would be too stupid to do. How would someone create a mod that does it accurately? 

CaptGodzillaPig #47 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:38 PM

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Funny, I was away from the game for a bit for personal reasons and just started playing last week.  Much to my surprise the game was a lot more fun.  Not that I had simply missed playing and it was good to be back kind of fun, but the over all demeanor of the players in chat was lighthearted and fun.   It was overall just more enjoyable.   Sure had some good games and bad and played with good players and not so good players, but most of the toxic was gone.  (still happened occasionally).    Maybe this is a bonus side effect of uptight people leaving because the game wasn't tailored specifically for their needs?
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TenguBlade #48 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:39 PM

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View Post1nv4d3rZ1m, on 24 April 2017 - 03:37 PM, said:

Wait there is a mod that tells people how ships will maneuver? How does that even work? Is a mod now able to predict the actions of people? 


I consider myself pretty good at this game and a lot of its based on predicting peoples behavior and yet people constantly surprise me by making moves I thought would be too stupid to do. How would someone create a mod that does it accurately? 

It's nothing more than an excuse for an above-average player's refusal to see where he can improve.  I believe there is an "aim assist" that gives the correct at-the-moment lead for a target (I don't see why not, the bots have to have some sort of aiming AI), but it doesn't work if your target changes course - of course, it has to be radical-enough to cause a miss, but as I said earlier it's only easier to do so as tiers go up because of the greater accuracy of guns across the board.  I got nailed for a double-cit by a Kawachi in a Jurien de la Graviere yesterday because a shell from his #4 turret and #1 turret flew half a kilometer away from the rest and butt-penned me.


Edited by TenguBlade, 24 April 2017 - 08:43 PM.

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Fox_Cruiser_Marseillaise #49 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:41 PM

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View Post1nv4d3rZ1m, on 24 April 2017 - 03:37 PM, said:

 

Wait there is a mod that tells people how ships will maneuver? How does that even work? Is a mod now able to predict the actions of people? 

I consider myself pretty good at this game and a lot of its based on predicting peoples behavior and yet people constantly surprise me by making moves I thought would be too stupid to do. How would someone create a mod that does it accurately? 

 

In Beta the famous aim-mod gave a really nice prediction showing the targets future course based on speed and direction. I saw a number of vids of it being used and it very nicely dialed up the accuracy for anyone using it.

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dseehafer #50 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:41 PM

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View PostFox_Cruiser_Algerie, on 24 April 2017 - 02:37 PM, said:

Kick-[edited]premiums?  OK...MAYBE the Scharnhorst. The others are mostly gimmicky or have glaring weaknesses for the money spent. I have MANY, MANY premiums. Some I like, some I don't. But to say I'll be missing out on kick-a$$ premiums is overstating it by a large margin. Most premiums are Wargaming wallet-raids.

 

I'm not referring to in-game performance, I'm referring to big-name ships that WG is adding this year like Alabama, d'Aosta, Roma, Graf Zeppelin, Hood... ships that are significant/cool for varying reasons. Aosta is the first Italian ship, Alabama finally brings to the game the last missing class of USN fast battleships so on and so forth.

 

TLDR: Kick-A$$ as in "cool", not necessarily "good". Sorry for the confusion. 


Edited by dseehafer, 24 April 2017 - 08:42 PM.

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bassmasta76 #51 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:44 PM

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View PostFox_Cruiser_Algerie, on 24 April 2017 - 03:15 PM, said:

I use both, trying dodging a tight BB spread at 17km with BOTH skills and rudder shift mod. Won't help, TBQH.

 

Fair enough... just figured I'd offer a suggestion with what works for me.  Best of luck to you.  Perhaps some time away would be helpful.  I didnt play for about 2 weeks while I was busy with stuff in RL and when I came back, it felt refreshing.  just a thought..

 

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TenguBlade #52 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:45 PM

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View PostFox_Cruiser_Algerie, on 24 April 2017 - 03:41 PM, said:

In Beta the famous aim-mod gave a really nice prediction showing the targets future course based on speed and direction. I saw a number of vids of it being used and it very nicely dialed up the accuracy for anyone using it.

As I and many other have already said, here and in other places, that mod only predicts your course accurately if you do not alter it.  No AI can predict human behavior - to paraphrase from Star Wars: "If droids could think, there'd be none of us here, would there?"

View PostFox_Cruiser_Algerie, on 24 April 2017 - 03:15 PM, said:

I use both, trying dodging a tight BB spread at 17km with BOTH skills and rudder shift mod. Won't help, TBQH.

Of course it won't when the only evasive maneuver you took was after I fired at you and the shells were over halfway there, if not later.  Not helping you is that it was a textbook full-speed turn-away maneuver.  If you added any throttle reduction at all to that, you could have steepened the degree of your turn and maybe spared yourself some health.


Edited by TenguBlade, 24 April 2017 - 08:47 PM.

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Fox_Cruiser_Marseillaise #53 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:46 PM

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Tengu:

 

 

Easy for you to say when you cruise around with four battleship buddies wielding guns that can wipeout 40k health with a single volley. I've TRIED to use various dodging techniques, adjusted my captain skills, upped my situational awareness. The only thing that has happened is my damage output has dropped considerably, my win rate with it, as I become a more passive backline camper.

 

I hate that and won't join that meta. If thats what WG wants me to do, well they can [edited]pike right off.


Edited by Fox_Cruiser_Algerie, 24 April 2017 - 08:47 PM.

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kerensky914 #54 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:46 PM

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View Post1nv4d3rZ1m, on 24 April 2017 - 02:37 PM, said:

 

Wait there is a mod that tells people how ships will maneuver? How does that even work? Is a mod now able to predict the actions of people? 

I consider myself pretty good at this game and a lot of its based on predicting peoples behavior and yet people constantly surprise me by making moves I thought would be too stupid to do. How would someone create a mod that does it accurately? 

You can't predict their actions, but you could predict where they'll be if nothing changes.  Essentially exactly what I'm doing in the example I gave above, but computed exactly.  In other words, such a mod would compute a targets course, speed, and rate of change, and using your range to target and shell flight time, give you an aim point for where that target will be.  With just a bit of experience, most players can do this without needing the 'cheat'.  Some are better at it than others, of course.  And a target in a full-lock turn is actually easier to hit because they can't really evade - they are already turning hard, and it takes several seconds to get their rudder all the way over the other direction to cut their turn.


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1nv4d3rZ1m #55 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:47 PM

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View PostFox_Cruiser_Algerie, on 24 April 2017 - 01:41 PM, said:

 

In Beta the famous aim-mod gave a really nice prediction showing the targets future course based on speed and direction. I saw a number of vids of it being used and it very nicely dialed up the accuracy for anyone using it.

 

That showed predictions based on the current course of the ship, any maneuvering done in the future made the predictions inaccurate. Thats why I wondered about your claim that someone made a mod that could predict a ships future maneuvers and provide an aim point. 

 

I was in beta and actually went into a training room against people that claimed the mod made them unbeatable and beat them with my own eyeball mk 1. Any changes in course after the shots were fired would cause misses and the mod couldnt accurately predict maneuvers based on things happening like carrier planes and islands.

 

 Are you going to back up your claim that a mod exists that can predict how I maneuver my ship and tell you where to aim or what? 



kerensky914 #56 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:51 PM

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All this is really beside the point.  If the game truly isn't fun for you, then you should by all means do something else. 

"it is a tale, told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." - MacBeth, who was obviously talking about the forums...

"Doctors can always bury their mistakes.  Architects can only advise their client to plant vines." - Frank Lloyd Wright

Wulfgarn #57 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:51 PM

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View Post1nv4d3rZ1m, on 24 April 2017 - 03:47 PM, said:

 

That showed predictions based on the current course of the ship, any maneuvering done in the future made the predictions inaccurate. Thats why I wondered about your claim that someone made a mod that could predict a ships future maneuvers and provide an aim point. 

 

I was in beta and actually went into a training room against people that claimed the mod made them unbeatable and beat them with my own eyeball mk 1. Any changes in course after the shots were fired would cause misses and the mod couldnt accurately predict maneuvers based on things happening like carrier planes and islands.

 

 Are you going to back up your claim that a mod exists that can predict how I maneuver my ship and tell you where to aim or what? 

 

There is one that shows an aim assist similar to the one y"all are talking about. It also shows where the enemy shells are going to land.

Edited by Wulfgarn, 24 April 2017 - 08:52 PM.

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1nv4d3rZ1m #58 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:52 PM

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View Postkerensky914, on 24 April 2017 - 01:46 PM, said:

You can't predict their actions, but you could predict where they'll be if nothing changes.  Essentially exactly what I'm doing in the example I gave above, but computed exactly.  In other words, such a mod would compute a targets course, speed, and rate of change, and using your range to target and shell flight time, give you an aim point for where that target will be.  With just a bit of experience, most players can do this without needing the 'cheat'.  Some are better at it than others, of course.  And a target in a full-lock turn is actually easier to hit because they can't really evade - they are already turning hard, and it takes several seconds to get their rudder all the way over the other direction to cut their turn.

 

Except a good player can predict how people will maneuver after they shoot, thats how they get hits. For example I can guess if planes are going to drop on someone that they will likely turn in so I aim short and hit, the mod wouldnt predict that and if you had shot on the mods prediction you would have missed. Or if I am shooting at someone that consistently slows and turns into shots I can adjust my aim to be short and low so even with the dodging I still hit. 

 

Thats why you cant simply react to how people shoot because people can adjust their pattern of shooting and lock you into known behavior. One of my favorite tactics is to fire a turret or two at a ship so they start turning to avoid the shells, then they are stuck for the other shells because its still easy to predict a turn and harder to change a turn because the rudder has less options. 

 

View PostWulfgarn, on 24 April 2017 - 01:51 PM, said:

 

There is one that shows an aim assist similar to the one y"all are talking about. It also shows where the enemy shell are going to land.

 

Does it predict how the ship is going to maneuver in the future? Thats really the question, the OP claimed a mod would predict how he maneuvered so he would get hit no matter what he did. 


Edited by 1nv4d3rZ1m, 24 April 2017 - 08:53 PM.


SmirkingGerbil #59 Posted 24 April 2017 - 08:55 PM

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This thread is entertaining. I thought hackusation threads were a unique experience to WoT forums. I guess the infection has spread.

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The_Dastardly_Canuck_rob #60 Posted 24 April 2017 - 09:01 PM

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View PostSmirkingGerbil, on 24 April 2017 - 03:55 PM, said:

This thread is entertaining. I thought hackusation threads were a unique experience to WoT forums. I guess the infection has spread.

 

Happens in any game that has bad players. 




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