Jump to content


Maybe removing invisifire will shake up high tier gameplay.


  • Please log in to reply
58 replies to this topic

TheDreadnought #1 Posted 20 March 2017 - 08:54 PM

    Ensign

  • Beta Testers

  • 1,106
  • Member since:
    08-09-2012

The plain fact of life is that high tier gameplay sucks.  Its really not worth progressing past tier 8 right now.  Maybe once open water invisifire is gone, play will get a little more dynamic.  Battleships might advance more once they're no longer subject to a continual rain of shells they can do nothing to counter or escape from.

 

I'm sure some people will say it won't help at all.  I guess we'll find out.

 

All we know for sure is that the way things are set up right now is not working.  Its time to make some changes.


Edited by TheDreadnought, 20 March 2017 - 08:55 PM.


ckupf #2 Posted 20 March 2017 - 08:57 PM

    Lieutenant

  • Members

  • 1,950
  • Member since:
    07-31-2015

View PostTheDreadnought, on 20 March 2017 - 08:54 PM, said:

 

Its time to make some changes.

 

Change for the sake of change is idiotic, more likely to make it worse than better.

 

Make some changes, but make sure they are good changes.



Fog_Battleship_NCarolina #3 Posted 20 March 2017 - 08:59 PM

    Ensign

  • Beta Testers
  • In AlfaTesters

  • 1,138
  • Member since:
    01-16-2013
Stealth fire needs to be removed but I still find high tier gameplay to be the most enjoyable.

 

PC Specs- Gigabyte G1 GTX 1080, i7 6700k @ 4.7ghz, 16gb 2400mhz GSkills Ripjaw Ram, Asus Z170 E, EVGA 650W Power supply, Corsair Carbide 400C, 240gb Hyper X ssd, 2 1TB WD Blacks, HBT artica 240 AOI


JervisBay #4 Posted 20 March 2017 - 08:59 PM

    Lieutenant

  • Members

  • 1,721
  • Member since:
    01-19-2016

View Postckupf, on 21 March 2017 - 08:27 AM, said:

 

Make some changes, but make sure they are good changes.

 

Well, duh!

The only way to determine if they are good is to actually make the changes. :facepalm:


oo-OOOO-oo+oo-OOOO-oo

Canadatron #5 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:02 PM

    Commander

  • Members

  • 3,080
  • Member since:
    12-31-2015
And what if this isn't the magic bullet? I'll guarantee that invisifiring isn't what keeps the game bogged down at high tiers. It won't change. 
-={FOG}=- Community Member

taut #6 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:02 PM

    Admiral of the Navy

  • Members

  • 16,312
  • Member since:
    11-19-2013
It just is what it is, removing Invisi fire isn't drastic enough to change the "meta". I honestly don't think there is anything terribly wrong with high tier play, tho I don't play it all that often.

 

 


TheDreadnought #7 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:05 PM

    Ensign

  • Beta Testers

  • 1,106
  • Member since:
    08-09-2012

View Postckupf, on 20 March 2017 - 08:57 PM, said:

 

Change for the sake of change is idiotic, more likely to make it worse than better.

 

Make some changes, but make sure they are good changes.

 

Ultimately in this game, there's only so much you can do to predict player behavior.  For something like that you just have to try it and see if it works.

 

The only thing idiotic would be sticking with what isn't working.



Pulicat #8 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:05 PM

    Commander

  • Members

  • 3,655
  • Member since:
    07-02-2013

Your personal opinion is not a fact of life.

Tier 10s are played proportional to other tiers if you consider how many people will have made it to tier 10, 9 etc.

I actually enjoy the 8-10 gameplay. It takes considerably more strategy, patience and skill to outplay your opponents simply because the skill level of players is improved the higher tier you go.

I dislike low tier games, but i'm not going to let my thoughts allow me to make a claim that a lot of people think that, or that low tier games are bad.

 

Invisifire is also not your problem. You are only really suffering invisifire from US DDs at this point, and they are very inaccurate. Akizuki is a true abuser of this mechanic, but everything beyond that can do without in much the same way.


 


TheDreadnought #9 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:06 PM

    Ensign

  • Beta Testers

  • 1,106
  • Member since:
    08-09-2012

View Postslak__, on 20 March 2017 - 09:02 PM, said:

It just is what it is, removing Invisi fire isn't drastic enough to change the "meta". I honestly don't think there is anything terribly wrong with high tier play, tho I don't play it all that often.

 

Maybe if high tier play was more fun, you might be inspired to play it more often.

Mesrith #10 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:07 PM

    Commander

  • Members
  • Beta Testers

  • 3,026
  • Member since:
    08-09-2012

Stealth fire removal will be hardly noticed at high tiers (9 and 10).  Zao will lose a ~3km window, with Ibuki, but Khab was a primary issue and it has also been removed last year.  Khab will still run around, fully visible, dancing and taunting while it rains fire.  Other ships can stealth fire now, but I don't think it's a huge factor for most of them, despite the occasional AFT Gearing that I see trying to hit me from 13km or whatever.

 

Some people like playing lower tiers, where they can derp more often without being instantly punished, which is what tier 9-10 armament does.  Survivability doesn't scale at the same pace as Cold War or fictional firepower, so making a mistake is more hazardous.  Removing stealth fire is only a small part of that.



Canadatron #11 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:11 PM

    Commander

  • Members

  • 3,080
  • Member since:
    12-31-2015
Fletcher will still torp, Khabarovsk will rain pain, Shima will still launch "walls of skill" and people will still find a reason to reverse out of spawn.  It's the way things are.
-={FOG}=- Community Member

TheDreadnought #12 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:14 PM

    Ensign

  • Beta Testers

  • 1,106
  • Member since:
    08-09-2012

View PostPulicat, on 20 March 2017 - 09:05 PM, said:

Your personal opinion is not a fact of life.

Tier 10s are played proportional to other tiers if you consider how many people will have made it to tier 10, 9 etc.

I actually enjoy the 8-10 gameplay. It takes considerably more strategy, patience and skill to outplay your opponents simply because the skill level of players is improved the higher tier you go.

I dislike low tier games, but i'm not going to let my thoughts allow me to make a claim that a lot of people think that, or that low tier games are bad.

 

Invisifire is also not your problem. You are only really suffering invisifire from US DDs at this point, and they are very inaccurate. Akizuki is a true abuser of this mechanic, but everything beyond that can do without in much the same way.

 

 

I think you're flat out wrong on the enjoyability of high tier play.  But let's see what people think.  Maybe I'm alone in feeling this way.  But I don't think so.


 

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/119386-do-you-enjoy-high-tier-gameplay-as-it-exists-today/


 


 



taut #13 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:16 PM

    Admiral of the Navy

  • Members

  • 16,312
  • Member since:
    11-19-2013

View PostTheDreadnought, on 20 March 2017 - 05:06 PM, said:

 

Maybe if high tier play was more fun, you might be inspired to play it more often.

Yes and no.

 

I haven't been playing enough to feel comfortable at high tiers, that's my reason.

 

But maybe high tiers should be less "fun", the higher the tier the more skilled you should be in theory. The more stressful it will be for the less skilled and likely less fun. 

 

T10 should be for serious play imo, it should be where high skilled players go to shoot at each other...


 

 


awiggin #14 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:19 PM

    Rear Admiral

  • Members

  • 6,245
  • Member since:
    10-03-2015

They have attempted several changes, and failed miserably in all of them...

They bred a certain mindset with the absurd cost structure at top tier and now they are paying the price. Even though they made it possible to play tier 10 for a price,they can't change the mindset. Many players are still unwilling to spend the money at top tier, still haven't even figured out that dying is meaningless, and simply fear looking bad by getting insta-deleted.

Not sure there is an answer, the meta has become so entrenched, you often see it at lower tiers now too.


 

 


1nc0mp3t3nt_1 #15 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:24 PM

    Captain

  • Beta Testers
  • In AlfaTesters

  • 5,915
  • Member since:
    01-29-2015

View PostTheDreadnought, on 21 March 2017 - 06:54 AM, said:

The plain fact of life is that high tier gameplay sucks.  Its really not worth progressing past tier 8 right now.  Maybe once open water invisifire is gone, play will get a little more dynamic.  Battleships might advance more once they're no longer subject to a continual rain of shells they can do nothing to counter or escape from.

 

I'm sure some people will say it won't help at all.  I guess we'll find out.

 

All we know for sure is that the way things are set up right now is not working.  Its time to make some changes.

No. My predictions are the bulk of people will revert to putting torpedos everywhere when possible to try and do damage without being spotted. 

 

Complaints will rise about this, and torpedo defense buffs will be implemented, followed swiftly by increased torpedo visibility on skills like Vigilance and a reduction in speed of torpedos. 

 

Then the destroyers will be forced to fire from max range, increasing complaints about battleship dispersion and how RNG based the entire game is from the perspective of one class of players. 

 

WG will relent, decreasing the max firing range of all destroyers, making them vulnerable permanently to everything on the map. 

 

Good thing I have been practicing in German DDs



Fog_Battleship_NCarolina #16 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:24 PM

    Ensign

  • Beta Testers
  • In AlfaTesters

  • 1,138
  • Member since:
    01-16-2013

View PostTheDreadnought, on 20 March 2017 - 04:14 PM, said:

 

 

I think you're flat out wrong on the enjoyability of high tier play.  But let's see what people think.  Maybe I'm alone in feeling this way.  But I don't think so.


 

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/119386-do-you-enjoy-high-tier-gameplay-as-it-exists-today/


 


 

 

Did you not read what he wrote? His point was your opinion is not a fact. Everyone's view on this game is subjective, and we are all entitled to our own opinions of what is fun and what isn't.

 

PC Specs- Gigabyte G1 GTX 1080, i7 6700k @ 4.7ghz, 16gb 2400mhz GSkills Ripjaw Ram, Asus Z170 E, EVGA 650W Power supply, Corsair Carbide 400C, 240gb Hyper X ssd, 2 1TB WD Blacks, HBT artica 240 AOI


SireneRacker #17 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:26 PM

    Captain

  • Members

  • 4,629
  • Member since:
    07-14-2015
If the removal of invisible fire forces me to rely on Torps only in my Kagerou then I don't want to hear the following whine threads from those BBs who can't use WASD

Proud member of [WAIFU], nothing beats Prinz Eugen

 

Torpedoes don't have any friends. So they will kill everything in their path. To prevent team kills we should all watch out where we fire those fishes. That means each and everyone of us, DDs of the second line!

No my name does NOT refer to those things from Odysseus! They refer to those loud things attached to a fire truck. Not to beautiful girls singing on the Ocean.


Mesrith #18 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:27 PM

    Commander

  • Members
  • Beta Testers

  • 3,026
  • Member since:
    08-09-2012

View PostTheDreadnought, on 20 March 2017 - 03:14 PM, said:

 

 

I think you're flat out wrong on the enjoyability of high tier play.  But let's see what people think.  Maybe I'm alone in feeling this way.  But I don't think so.


 

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/119386-do-you-enjoy-high-tier-gameplay-as-it-exists-today/


 


 

 

Maybe play more than a handful of games above tier 8 and you'll find it enjoyable, particularly in something that's not a Baltimore.

1nc0mp3t3nt_1 #19 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:28 PM

    Captain

  • Beta Testers
  • In AlfaTesters

  • 5,915
  • Member since:
    01-29-2015

View PostSireneRacker, on 21 March 2017 - 07:26 AM, said:

If the removal of invisible fire forces me to rely on Torps only in my Kagerou then I don't want to hear the following whine threads from those BBs who can't use WASD

Yep, started already just minutes after my post

View Post1nc0mp3t3nt_1, on 21 March 2017 - 07:24 AM, said:

No. My predictions are the bulk of people will revert to putting torpedos everywhere when possible to try and do damage without being spotted. 

 

Complaints will rise about this, and torpedo defense buffs will be implemented, followed swiftly by increased torpedo visibility on skills like Vigilance and a reduction in speed of torpedos. 

 

Then the destroyers will be forced to fire from max range, increasing complaints about battleship dispersion and how RNG based the entire game is from the perspective of one class of players. 

 

WG will relent, decreasing the max firing range of all destroyers, making them vulnerable permanently to everything on the map. 

 

Good thing I have been practicing in German DDs

Come on now magic 8 ball, tell me the lottery numbers needed to win next week's $30 million



GhostSwordsman #20 Posted 20 March 2017 - 09:32 PM

    Lieutenant Commander

  • Members

  • 2,881
  • Member since:
    07-02-2015

Removing the ability to invisi-fire on open water isn't going to change squat. Well, except for maybe a few DDs.

 

Most of the 'invisi-firing' being done at high tier is due to abuse of island cover and LoS mechanics, not from being on open water with a gun range greater than the detection range.


          warships.today stats(direct link)     Wargaming.net WoWs profile overview

~You are an ocean of waves, weaving a dream, Like thoughts become a river stream, Yet may the tide ever change, flowing like time, To the path, -yours to claim~Thou seek the dark with an unsheathed blade, Now a white, ivory throne beckons, So obtain the fate you sow, On this path, be weary, friend and foe~ - "Lost in Thoughts All Alone" English Cover - by Amalee

Soshi_Sone, on 26 April 2017 - 05:36 PM, said:

Literally speaking, one can only run into Lert if one is not alert.
Ultimate BBQQ Recipe: 1 BB(the bigger, the juicier), 2 or more Cruisers and/or Destroyers, HE spam(apply generously), no salt required. Smoking your BBQQ is optional, but it adds lots of extra flavor.  Melt for 3-10 minutes and enjoy! Serve with fish for an even more exotic taste!




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users