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Co-op Play at Tier 8

Play at Tier 8

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Yorcke #1 Posted 23 February 2017 - 10:45 PM

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I just suffered through 3 straight defeats playing a New Orleans in Co-op at Tier 8

Our teams just melted away with hardly a peep from anyone. I don't think that fighting bots at this level is that difficult, but our teams just couldn't manage to do jacksh*t.

Also our team had 6 bots in one game - they can't do jacksh*t either and just melt like turds in the rain.

Is there even any point in playing C0-0p at this Tier - just seems like a total waste of time.

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Macabe #2 Posted 23 February 2017 - 10:47 PM

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Majority of the playerbase doesn't play co-op. It's just not economically worthwhile(nor should it be).

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Pulicat #3 Posted 23 February 2017 - 10:47 PM

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The point of playing co-op is to get away from pvp.

 


awiggin #4 Posted 23 February 2017 - 10:49 PM

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View PostYorcke, on 23 February 2017 - 02:45 PM, said:

I just suffered through 3 straight defeats playing a New Orleans in Co-op at Tier 8

Our teams just melted away with hardly a peep from anyone. I don't think that fighting bots at this level is that difficult, but our teams just couldn't manage to do jacksh*t.

Also our team had 6 bots in one game - they can't do jacksh*t either and just melt like turds in the rain.

Is there even any point in playing C0-0p at this Tier - just seems like a total waste of time.

Comments?

 

Money losing proposition without premium, and even then just breaking even at tier 8. WG does expect you to pay for the right to play top tier ships in co-op or random

 


 

 


alexf24 #5 Posted 23 February 2017 - 11:12 PM

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I play Coop at any tier. Money is not the object. Quick fun or testing is.

 

Indeed, you can lose a match easily in T8 Coop if your team is crap.

 


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AdmiralThunder #6 Posted 24 February 2017 - 02:32 AM

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Actually I see a lot of T8 guys in Co-op. More common than many think I believe. I personally prefer it as it is less stress and the people, on the whole, seem nicer and more willing to cooperate.

 

I actually find Random to have more crappy teams( one side always smucks the other - almost never a good match when I have tried it ). Always seems one team is wiped out and the other has 6-10 guys left. Just isn't fun because the people on the losing team all blame each other even when it isn't anyone's fault. It is why I hate it. It is just a game. Do your best and if you win you win and if you lose you lose. When it is taken so serious it isn't fun and not worth playing IMO.

 

Co-op may be easier but is isn't the cake walk so many claim. Lots of guys who start the game in chat about how they are going to destroy the BOTS who die fast( who then blame the team and not themselves - that isn't unique to Random ). BOTS as a rule are much better shots than humans( sometimes I swear they never miss )and they can be like a dog on a bone if they focus you.

 

As to payout. yes, it is less in Co-op for sure. I have played it with T7 Fiji and you can make money most games or break even at the least unless you do absolutely nothing. They lowered the service fee in Co-op recently and that helps. I wish they would lower it to equal the reduction they use for XP and Credits which seems to be about 50% of Random. Less ships to farm damage on and the games go quicker so you use less resources. Service Fee should be far less than it is.

 

I don't get those who look down at Co-op and think no one should ever play it? People should be able to play the game version they wish. If it is PVP that is fine. If it is PVE that is fine too. I don't see why it should matter.  


Edited by AdmiralThunder, 24 February 2017 - 02:34 AM.


Taylor3006 #7 Posted 24 February 2017 - 06:51 AM

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The payout difference between tier 7 and 8 in PvE is huge. I have no trouble making credits at tier 7 but recently just unlocked my Benson (tier 8 DD) and my first game in her had an average game, 50k ish damage and I lost 56 thousand credits....... Will only play tier 8 now with the extra credits flag, reduced service flag, first win bonus, and premium time. Just not worth it any other way IMHO. Add to that the upgrades for the ship are almost 20,000 exp each and there are 4 or 5 of them, just makes it more unlikely I will have any interest playing at tier 8 in anything but my premium ships and only use them to grind captains on first win bonuses. It is punishing and there is no real incentive to continue to grind up other than "cool ships".

Eisennagel #8 Posted 24 February 2017 - 05:06 PM

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Coop at T6 or even T7 is too easy.  At T8, you can be in for an occasional nasty surprise.  I consider this the most fun tier for coop.

 

One reason why human loses to bots happen is when the humans don't support the friendly bots in their team when the bots advance. 

 

Friendly bots tend to be a disadvantage because they are usually picked at the lowest tier --- if you are Tier 8, they are likely to be Tier 6 --- and are always cruisers and destroyers.  


Edited by Eisennagel, 24 February 2017 - 05:06 PM.


centarina #9 Posted 24 February 2017 - 05:23 PM

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at t8,  i love farming salt with cruisers in random.    I seem to be more consistent with Cruisers at t8 compared to other classes.  even NO  does fine  with the buff.  not as easy as chapayev, but  playable and more of a closer range ambusher.

 

I would avoid coop unless you are retraining.   you will be filled with bot on your team and that makes it even tougher.


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A66hawks14 #10 Posted 24 February 2017 - 05:36 PM

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Co-op is not as easy as most would suggest.  if you make a mistake, they will punish you for it. an it seems they never miss.  Team work is key when there are only a couple of actual players on you team.  Lower player levels during the week combined with high costs, means that the chances for a bot team is high.  I used to only play co-op because i could never connect at the start. I play it now because it is less stressful.

                                                                        

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AdmiralThunder #11 Posted 24 February 2017 - 10:52 PM

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I must be lucky because even when there are a lot of T8 on the team in Co-op it is human. Very seldom do I see any friendly BOTS. Pretty much only see that if I am playing at some off hour. I do agree with the poster above who mentioned that it is always DD or CL/CA. Never seen a friendly BOT BB or CV.

Edited by AdmiralThunder, 24 February 2017 - 10:52 PM.


Shokaku_1 #12 Posted 27 February 2017 - 10:16 PM

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Bots are very aggressive in co-op games. Most of time you'll be fighting enemies around 10km or less, if your ship doesn't have torpedo, sometimes it'll be awkward. If you try to play safe and stay back, then you'll get too many bad games because your team-mates get all the kills or your team-mates get killed too easily and you are left 1 vs. 6 or 7.

 

New Orleans is just not very fun in co-op because it doesn't has torps, on other hand, Hipper is great in co-op with so many fast reloading torps.



SalvoSanta #13 Posted 28 February 2017 - 01:20 PM

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I have to play co-op if I want a t10 match because of the time of day that I play - there's usually only 3k people on and the queue times are ridiculous.

 

The bots on the other team are 10000% accurate and your team generally melts, it's true.

 

I also find that bot team mates are less useless than real people lately.


Edited by SalvoSanta, 28 February 2017 - 01:32 PM.


Maximus_the_Furry #14 Posted 28 February 2017 - 01:25 PM

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My experience has been:

  • You end up with bots on your coop team when the server population is low...
  • There seem to be fewer coop players at high tier,   You lose credits at high tier if you have a weak match.
  • Somehow, some of the bots seem to play better than others, dodge torps..
  • Coop is relaxing and fun, mostly no salt...I suspect that the average age is a bit older than random..


SkipJack67 #15 Posted 28 February 2017 - 01:57 PM

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I played about 40% of my total games in co-op.

Yes, bots are aggressive with precision aiming.  Their hit rate probably somewhere around 70%.   Kind of good for me to practice WASD, if I can dodged most of their shells I can probably do the same thing in random.

Last evening I took the Atago out for fun.  There were about 6,000 players on, so we only have 2 human on our team.   As soon as the battle started, bots starting to steamrolled us two.   Later only 1 bot on our side left vs 2 on bot side.   Somehow our bot managed to sink both of the enemy ships and we won the match….yay!!!  :P


AdmiralThunder #16 Posted 28 February 2017 - 11:59 PM

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View PostSalvoSanta, on 28 February 2017 - 08:20 AM, said:

I have to play co-op if I want a t10 match because of the time of day that I play - there's usually only 3k people on and the queue times are ridiculous.

 

The bots on the other team are 10000% accurate and your team generally melts, it's true.

 

I also find that bot team mates are less useless than real people lately.

 

​Anyone who says Co-op is easy, they are just BOTS, hasn't played it lately. You nailed it, they are insanely OP accurate. Even with incoming fire alert and such you have a hard time not getting hit by them when they shoot at you. AND when they do hit it does butt loads of damage. They don't miss and they hit you hard time and again. Also, they start fires super easy. Can't count the times I get set on fire by 1 shell from a DD and it is the very 1st hit of the game. It's like WTH? LOL 

 

Co-op is like this...

 

Start moving, get detected, get targeted( start WASD ), incoming fire alert( WASD like mad ), get nailed time after time. I play mostly Co-op but have played Random as well. Far and away the BOTS are superior shots. They are super aggressive and will hunt you like a pack of rabid dogs as well. They also are very good about staying bow on/angled when chasing you and they always use the right ammo choice.

 

Random is more challenging because humans are unpredictable and the BOTS not so much but that is getting better too. Really there are 2 things they do that hurts the BOTS ability to win more. One is to run straight for too long vs. humans, which let's them get one shot more, but that is improving. The other thing is to stay focused on one target and ignore others that make more sense. It's like I am at 14km in my healthy Cleveland supporting 2 BB's taking on a BOT BB with my HE. Both BB's are within 5km of the enemy BB but it shoots at me 14km away. That makes no sense. Yes, the HE from the Cleveland is bad but those big BB guns right next to you are the bigger threat and the chances of one shoting me are very small. .

 

I suspect if they ever correct those 2 issues and make them maneuver more and switch targets more Co-op will be a whole new game. BUT, with the vastly superior accuracy and super aggressive play Co-op is not a cake walk even now like so many claim. I see a lot of T8 players in chat waiting for the game to start spouting off about how easy BOTS are and how they will just Lemming down the middle to their doom. Usually they are the 1st players to die.. LOL. 

 



ReddNekk #17 Posted 05 March 2017 - 07:33 AM

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Block Quote

Friendly bots tend to be a disadvantage because they are usually picked at the lowest tier --- if you are Tier 8, they are likely to be Tier 6 --- and are always cruisers and destroyers.

 There's a advantage to having bots on your team; They're never AFK!  :great:

 

 If you want to learn how to survive the undivided attention of multiple enemies, you'll learn  it in Co-Op.

 


Edited by ReddNekk, 05 March 2017 - 07:42 AM.

Hold my beer and watch this!
 

 

KnightFandragon #18 Posted 05 March 2017 - 07:46 AM

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View PostMacabe, on 23 February 2017 - 10:47 PM, said:

Majority of the playerbase doesn't play co-op. It's just not economically worthwhile(nor should it be).

 

Yes, yes it should be.  If players could lose the PVP is masterrace woody, yeah, it should be. 

AdmiralThunder #19 Posted 05 March 2017 - 05:21 PM

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View PostKnightFandragon, on 05 March 2017 - 02:46 AM, said:

 

Yes, yes it should be.  If players could lose the PVP is masterrace woody, yeah, it should be. 

 

​I agree. People should be able to play the mode they want to and there should be no financial consequence, as there is now, for choosing Co-op over Random( at least from say T7+ where service fees are too high in Co-op ).

 

Quote

If you want to learn how to survive the undivided attention of multiple enemies, you'll learn  it in Co-Op.

 

AMEN! I think playing a lot of Co-op has actually made me a better defensive player when I do play Random. Those BOTS can get on you like a pack of wolves and they are relentless. Teaches you how to WASD while 4, 5, 6+ enemies are shooting at you in a hurry.



Macabe #20 Posted 05 March 2017 - 06:03 PM

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View PostKnightFandragon, on 04 March 2017 - 11:46 PM, said:

 

Yes, yes it should be.  If players could lose the PVP is masterrace woody, yeah, it should be. 

 

View PostKnightFandragon, on 04 March 2017 - 11:46 PM, said:

 

Yes, yes it should be.  If players could lose the PVP is masterrace woody, yeah, it should be. 

 

If AI were actually difficult and it was harder to get 90% win rates in co-op i'd advocate for better rewards but as it stands co-op is just too easy.

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