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Help NikoPower play a solid Destroyer.


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NikoPower #1 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:08 PM

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So I'm putting this out there. My DD player is definitely a work in progress. I mainly play Cruisers and want to branch out. So I've decided to let community coach me TASTEFULLY and CONSTRUCTIVELY. What did I do wrong? What did I do right?

 

I plan on, time permitting, adding a new replay every other day for you all to check out and give feedback on. Please keep the conversation on task.

 

Today's Replay:

 

Ship: Kamikaze

Map: Two Brothers

 

https://wowreplays.c...ze-Two_Brothers


 

"To be honest in some strange way when I think of Niko I just imagine a Corgi, like my brain knows that Niko is a human but the Corgi image just works." - Devastator5000

 


NikoPower #2 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:10 PM

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Battle Result for this round.

Posted Image

 

"To be honest in some strange way when I think of Niko I just imagine a Corgi, like my brain knows that Niko is a human but the Corgi image just works." - Devastator5000

 


StrixKitty #3 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:11 PM

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Nah I can't teach you much.

 

And what the heck are your settings? The graphics look amazing and vivid. Take a screenshot of that so I can copy. >.>


Edited by StrixKitty, 30 January 2017 - 11:50 PM.

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Lert #4 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:12 PM

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+1 for showing how a dev type person involves with the playerbase, rather than sitting on high on a throne.

 

I'll be following this thread to improve my own tin can play. A match like in the OP I would've considered a very good one.


(Above stats not guaranteed accurate. I'm a supertester and test ships don't always register correctly)

 

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RivertheRoyal #5 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:19 PM

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This is going to be a good thread, I think. I'll need to check back after watching the reply. 
River's Guide on Writing a Good Post—Required reading for some.
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GhostSwordsman #6 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:24 PM

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Hey Niko, might be a good idea in the future to 1) upload the screenshots of the battle results to wowreplays(gives us quick easy access to the full after battle report instead of uploading it to something like imgur and then posting it here), and 2) give us the detailed report screen, where potential damage, damage recieved, etc. are located. The detailed report screen in particular can really help some of us discern what you could have been doing better or were doing well. Though, if you don't want to show player names it might take a little extra time on your part to censor names out. :)

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~You are an ocean of waves, weaving a dream, Like thoughts become a river stream, Yet may the tide ever change, flowing like time, To the path, -yours to claim~Thou seek the dark with an unsheathed blade, Now a white, ivory throne beckons, So obtain the fate you sow, On this path, be weary, friend and foe~ - "Lost in Thoughts All Alone" English Cover - by Amalee

 

 

 

 


Lonewolfpj #7 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:25 PM

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Yeah can you share your PC settings.

Nachoo31 #8 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:34 PM

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More guns :P

Looking for Clan?  TheKriegsmarines [KMS]  

Have you clicked on the picture in my profile?  Enjoy!

http://na.warshipsto...836912/dark.png


NikoPower #9 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:35 PM

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Current Graphical Settings in game:

 

Spoiler

 

Running:

i7-6700

16GB Ram

 

These graphics were achievable as well on my previous build of :

i7-4790

16GB Ram

GTX 970 Stock


 

"To be honest in some strange way when I think of Niko I just imagine a Corgi, like my brain knows that Niko is a human but the Corgi image just works." - Devastator5000

 


Sir_Orrin #10 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:38 PM

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This might be a good time to actually try watching replays... I will report back later! :)

 

Spoiler

 


Nachoo31 #11 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:38 PM

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Too bad you can't look at replay without the Game.exe

Looking for Clan?  TheKriegsmarines [KMS]  

Have you clicked on the picture in my profile?  Enjoy!

http://na.warshipsto...836912/dark.png


GhostSwordsman #12 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:49 PM

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A couple critiques for you:

 

1) You popped smoke as soon as you got into A. If I were you, I wouldn't have done this, it's going to be extremely difficult for anything other than another Kamikaze to sneak up on you, and by dropping a smoke screen, you denied your allies the ability to track that Nagato and Pensacola until your cruisers got close enough to spot them. Plus, spotting damage helps pay the bills.

 

2) Narrow spreads! Wide spreads are good if you're firing into a cluster of enemy ships, but if you're targeting a single ship or two, use narrow spreads, especially on a destroyer like Kamikaze since you only shoot two torps per launcher. Wide spreads don't hurt as much on ships with more tubes per launcher. You were also rather lucky that the enemies seemed to not have WASD.exe hacks installed and running. :P

 

3) Way too slow on engaging that enemy DD(I noticed him a good 20 seconds or so before you swung your camera around. I was internally screaming DD! DD! DESTROYER TO YOUR STARBOARD! Pay attention to that mini-map, especially when you're scoped in ;) ). You were extremely lucky that he didn't decide to use his guns or torp you sooner. If it had been me, I would have been opening up with my guns at those ranges, and you would have gone into panic and had a greater chance of missing with torps.

 

4) Lastly, don't be afraid to use your guns if you're not the closest ship to an enemy and you're already spotted. It may be a bit selfish in a way, but you could have been pounding on that Graf Spee with your guns while your Kongo was reloading. The Graf had to worry about the BB and you were spotted anyway, so why not shoot him?

 

That was really all that stuck out to me. I'm by no means an expert in IJN DD play, or DD play in general, but those were some mistakes I did recognize.

 

 

Edit: Your Corgi flag goes really well with the New Years camouflage! :look:


Edited by GhostSwordsman, 30 January 2017 - 06:59 PM.

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~You are an ocean of waves, weaving a dream, Like thoughts become a river stream, Yet may the tide ever change, flowing like time, To the path, -yours to claim~Thou seek the dark with an unsheathed blade, Now a white, ivory throne beckons, So obtain the fate you sow, On this path, be weary, friend and foe~ - "Lost in Thoughts All Alone" English Cover - by Amalee

 

 

 

 


Umikami #13 Posted 30 January 2017 - 06:55 PM

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Niko;

Couldn't watch the replay as I do not have the proper program installed' which is frustrating but typical.

First, congratulations on a very good game.

Not great, but damn fine and good results.

You sank three ships, captured one cap solo and assisted on a second, got 4 torp hits with 3 floodings, and set a fire.

And is that a devastating strike icon I see?

Honestly, YOU should be the one teaching DD tactics; this is a damn good game.

( Didn't see the replay, so I don't know why you needed to use your guns. Usually I try to refrain from that as it can get me spotted quickly.)

Seriously, all I have to say is keep up the great work, and call me if you ever want to division;

I'd be GLAD to play with a division partner who has games like this.



pmgaudio #14 Posted 30 January 2017 - 07:12 PM

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View PostGhostSwordsman, on 30 January 2017 - 06:49 PM, said:

A couple critiques for you:

 

1) You popped smoke as soon as you got into A. If I were you, I wouldn't have done this, it's going to be extremely difficult for anything other than another Kamikaze to sneak up on you, and by dropping a smoke screen, you denied your allies the ability to track that Nagato and Pensacola until your cruisers got close enough to spot them. Plus, spotting damage helps pay the bills.

 

2) Narrow spreads! Wide spreads are good if you're firing into a cluster of enemy ships, but if you're targeting a single ship or two, use narrow spreads, especially on a destroyer like Kamikaze since you only shoot two torps per launcher. Wide spreads don't hurt as much on ships with more tubes per launcher. You were also rather lucky that the enemies seemed to not have WASD.exe hacks installed and running. :P

 

3) Way too slow on engaging that enemy DD(I noticed him a good 20 seconds or so before you swung your camera around. I was internally screaming DD! DD! DESTROYER TO YOUR STARBOARD! Pay attention to that mini-map, especially when you're scoped in ;) ). You were extremely lucky that he didn't decide to use his guns or torp you sooner. If it had been me, I would have been opening up with my guns at those ranges, and you would have gone into panic and had a greater chance of missing with torps.

 

4) Lastly, don't be afraid to use your guns if you're not the closest ship to an enemy and you're already spotted. It may be a bit selfish in a way, but you could have been pounding on that Graf Spee with your guns while your Kongo was reloading. The Graf had to worry about the BB and you were spotted anyway, so why not shoot him?

 

That was really all that stuck out to me. I'm by no means an expert in IJN DD play, or DD play in general, but those were some mistakes I did recognize.

 

 

Edit: Your Corgi flag goes really well with the New Years camouflage! :look:

yes this was great advice...and I have some too...
One thing I think is a GREAT skill for a DD capt., is Priority target...
It is great for high tier cruisers yes, but after trying it on my CLemson, I feel that it is one of the best things to have on a DD... Yes you get "detected" but.... if you are NOT targeted you can save that smoke... you can move behind that rock... you can SHOOT that SHIP...
It is really some of the best info you can get, to save a few seconds of smoke release and if you are teamed behind a BB you will know if you are targeted or if you can just fire at will and not have to worry just yet...

And it is only a tier one skill so one point for some of the best information a detected ship can get... "how many ships see me vs how many ships are TARGETING ME"...
but KUDOS Niko.... well done

 




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Take the Cannoli”
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BlailBlerg #15 Posted 30 January 2017 - 07:23 PM

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View PostNikoPower, on 30 January 2017 - 06:08 PM, said:

So I'm putting this out there. My DD player is definitely a work in progress. I mainly play Cruisers and want to branch out. So I've decided to let community coach me TASTEFULLY and CONSTRUCTIVELY. What did I do wrong? What did I do right?

 

I plan on, time permitting, adding a new replay every other day for you all to check out and give feedback on. Please keep the conversation on task.

 

Today's Replay:

 

Ship: Kamikaze

Map: Two Brothers

 

https://wowreplays.c...ze-Two_Brothers

 

This is a great idea, a subliminal way to teach players and maybe even Devs how DDs actually work.  DD play gets a lot of hyperbole for being super easy or super hard, or being super nerfed.  Its not that easy to describe in reality. 
However, I would really prefer you play games in the tech tree ships also, especially those mid-tier reworked IJN DDs that WG loves to say are totally balanced and working fine.  A lot of people hate them, they do worse than 50% all throughout the line, and a lot of people say they aren't even fun.  
Using Minekaze is cool, but it doesn't show you what people see when they grind these trees.  
Please play IJN t6s!  Fubuki and Hatsuharu.  And T8 Kagero.  

Also, with so many people telling you how they can't access the replays, I hope you consider this a call to make watching replays much easier in the game client.  Also, hoping for Mac support (if it is lacking). 
Secondly, this would be a good time to bring up the ability to spectate a match.  There are times we are waiting for friends, or can't play, but we wanna cheer our friends on, or coach them, and we can't spectate.  Even a delayed stream without communication would be better.  

 

Zampy #16 Posted 30 January 2017 - 07:23 PM

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I'll give this a look over this evening.  If you could upload a YT vid link I could watch it during some "busy" time at work and get you faster feedback.  PM me and I will even do a discord/phone chat with you to go over it.

RedSeaBear #17 Posted 30 January 2017 - 07:33 PM

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Just watched the replay and the Sinksalot Fleet has some suggestions. 

1. Captain Skills; You Really Really need Concealment Expert, the Kami twins are good but they become great with CE. Also I would buff your guns as much as possible, AFT for more range and either BFT or AR [maybe both] for faster reloads. 

1.5 If you can't use stealth for torpedo attacks you need to get good at using island cover and positing to sink ships with torps. 

2. I have no idea why you popped smoke when you got to A. As far as I could tell you weren't spotted so why deny your ability to see whats is coming. IJN dds don't like to be surprised they want to be the ones surprising other ships. Smoke needs to be used to cover retreats or team mates. 

3. You seemed a bit timid in your early actions. After taking A you could have pushed those ships north of the cap or helped that foolish DD who rushed the channel to B. If the way is clear keep pushing or move to where there are ship who need to sink. 

4. Map awareness, once the Pensacola was on fire I would have changed targets. Your focus on that cruiser almost got you sunk by not switching your focus to that Mutsuki soon enough. Really surprised you survived that encounter. That DD really screwed up its attack, it should have sank you. 

5. Wide spread isn't useful, it leaves gaps you can sail a barge through. Use those three by two's to create torpedo walls with Narrow spreads. 

6. If you had used guns when that Fujin showed up at B you might have been able to sink it. Don't be afraid to attack with your guns, especially when such a low HP target is in range. Laying the smoke for your team was a good call. But I would have rushed the Graf Spee with narrow spread torps. 

7. Why didn't you move directly to the D cap once B was secured. I know your team was close to winning but I've seen games lost because teams stopped pushing thinking they had won. 

 

Final thoughts; The Kami's are very good once you have a high level captain. These ships excel at scouting, early cap domination and stealth torpedo attacks. I like to stay near my team and scout for enemy destroyers and once the bigger ships have occupied themselves with my team mates I can attack them from the sides. But at some point you have to abandon you cloak of stealth and charge those big ships. Much excitement can be had rushing a Battleship at close range so you can torpedo their broad side from point blank range. Doesn't always work but it is fun. 

 

While your results are good, The Kami is capable of much more.

Kami R game results.


I believe a good destroyer player is one who embraces the spirit of those Brave Sailors of the Tin Can Navy at the Battle of Leyte Gulf. I hope this helps as I find a lot of enjoyment in playing the small boats and I want others to enjoy it as much as I do. 

The Sinksalot Fleet salutes all those brave enough to sail a Destroyer. 


                          ~Admiral of the Sinksalot Fleet~

                                               ʕ·ᴥ·ʔ


Fog_Cruiser_Maine #18 Posted 30 January 2017 - 07:33 PM

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I just wanted to point out that he is running mods, which is ironic because he is a WG employee, and one would think that a WG employee would play the game stock.

Anyway, I play a Kamakaze, and from what I saw, I think your play is OK. No issue on my end, except that you could be a little more careful with noticing who is around you. Any captain should be aware of what is around him all the time when in any ship.
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SireneRacker #19 Posted 30 January 2017 - 07:41 PM

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Let's get to work:

 

- At the beginning you charged right into the A-cap, but your team was at least 6km behind you. In the worst case one of the Leanders could've appeared around the corner and it would've been over for you.

- Inside the cap you laid down a smoke screen and stayed inside of it. The teammates that moved up now would've appreciated a spotting vessel and there was no immediate threat.

- You hesitated to charge against the two ships above A. With charge I mean getting in Torpedo position. It did work out in the end, but getting there a minute earlier could've helped dealing more damage.

- The first salvo against the Pensacola was a waste. Sorry but firing at 7.5km with 7km Torps is useless.

- How did you not notice the Mutsuki? He was literally next to you.

- With the Pensacola burning and at 500 hp left, a Torpedo salvo is not necessary. I am sure that you could've used that one better against the Nagato.

- You went very close to the Nagato. Too close considering that his Secondaries opened up and that he fired at you.

- When trying to hide inside a smokescreen like you did at B, try to slow down while laying down the smoke. Otherwise you will outrun your smoke generator and pop back into vision. 1/4 speed is recommended.


 

Torpedoes don`t have any friends. So they will kill everything in their path. To prevent team kills we should all watch out where we fire those fishes. That means each and everyone of us, DDs of the second line!

 

No my name does NOT refer to those things from Odysseus! They refer to the those loud things attached to a fire truck. Not to beautiful girls singing on the Ocean.


spotted43 #20 Posted 30 January 2017 - 07:48 PM

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Hi Niko,

 

1).  You should have the 4pt skill (10 pts needed) Concealment expert.

2).  You are running a Camo for extra free xp, almost every other camo gives -3% concealment.   With both ~ 5.4km spotting, would have allowed you more freedom in CAP at start.

3).  You decided to pop smoke without being detected.  In this case, I would have waited and seen if I was spotted before using a smoke.  If you can sit in CAP, without using your smoke, that is the best of both worlds.  I would have slowed to 1/2 speed and stayed on the edge of the CAP going clockwise.

4).  No torpedoes!  Use them when you enter the CAP circle.  You have a short (~48 sec) reload.   If you are going to stay in cap, use a salvo or two as potential guesses to where the enemy will enter the CAP circle.  You DO know where they are coming from since the game just started and you are one of the fastest boats.

5).  After the smoke and you held the cap, you still hung around.  You needed to be outside smoke once you held the cap to spot the enemy.   I would have been ready to leave the smoke just as the CAP flipped.

6).  When pursuing the BB and CA - you shot torpedoes when they were running away from you.  Very hard to hit a target running away with only 7km torps.  Also the great benefit of 2 torp launcher is the TIGHT spread.  You want that control when shooting at targets over 3kms away.

7).  At the end in B CAP, you seemed to be mixing up capturing the CAP (don't shoot your guns and reveal your position) and attacking (Don't try to get the CAP).  Pick one or the other.

 






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